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Thread: The Legend of Bath Salts chapter 1 of 6 : legend the phenomenon and the lore- long

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    Default The Legend of Bath Salts chapter 1 of 6 : legend the phenomenon and the lore- long

    I would like to make one thing clear I am writing this because i think bath salts are while fraught with danger are a way to say fuck you to big brother law maker, also i think this topic is funny, this legend will cover these topics:
    *the beginning and the ingrdients
    *the phenomenon itself
    *harm reduction
    *full education
    *purification
    *myths/misconceptions
    *media hysteria
    *common actives and common adulterants/fillers/cuts
    And more........... this is for education and harm reduction and wil include party pills


    So at some point aperson decided that after reading a few basic FDA laws and federal laws there were some loop-holes to be exploited in order to make bank of a rather small investment, what was this: the idea of taking a small amount of primary active stimulant compound and bulk it up with active and inactive fillers to reach 500mg or 1000mg.
    The object or goal was simple provide a cocaine or methamphetamine mimetic to the general poulation underthe guise of bath salts/plant food/energy powder. while the lable clearly states not for human consumtion thus being legally sold with the full knowledge that 1/2gram of euphoric nose numbing powder would be incredile to the working class,recreational stimulant users, and anybody looking for a lift.

    When this started in the USA the UK was crawling with every cathinone version of every amphetamine the list is staggering, and in the US 2 main compounds were the choice primary actives-they are mephedrone wich was most often plant food and bath salts most often MDPV, there were a few that were methylone and combinations of meph and MDPV.

    Im not going into huge detail about the beginning we all lived it.
    So we had:
    mephedrone: or 4-MMC(4-methylmethcathinone)- a short acting monoamine releaser of dopamine/serotonin/norepinephrine as well as re-uptake of these amines. It provided a similar feel to MDMA or meth but not exactly and had side effects likerominent vasoconstriction,hypertension,elevated heart rate, arrythmia,palpitations, ect.
    But it also provided profound euphoria, empathogenic effects, and social luberication along with sexual arousal, and seemed like a MDMA-esqe chem that had a short half-life leving the user to want more.

    Also was latter deemed monster MDPV: or 3,4-methylenedioxypyrovalerone- a srtong dopamine/norepinephrine re-uptake inhibitor with a half-life of easily over 30 hrs. active @1-5mg depending on indiviual and highly compulsive as the dopamine aspect was strongly over the norepinephrine.
    The MDPV was lacking 2 features of cocaines pharmacology-serotonin re-uptake and sigma-1 agonism alon with no local anesthetic properties.
    Yet it boasted a binding affinity and potency of 2 fold for the dopamine transporter over cocaine thus making it highly compulsive IF THE WRONG PERSON *ABUSED IT*

    Now stop........ I personally dont like stims but these 2 meph and peevee are some of the most interesting chems i have seen as of late from a neuropharmacological standpoint primarily Mephedrone*- thos looking for a replacement is like looking for a replace ment for MDMA it isnt the same chem so get over it, plus 4-mmc is not that hard to synth if your dying to have it, its abeutiful chemical and with proper precautions to minimalize vasoconstriction would be amazing
    As for MDPV- this is a working mans stim- a nice dose of 5-10mg for a nieve user can have them working 12-14 hr shifts easily( think of all the overtime you could get putting in those kind of hours) -THE DANGERS ARE LATTER

    back to so called bath salts, i had the pleasure of having access to gc/ms and NMR on one of these( gas chromatography/mass spectrometry and nuclear magnetic resonance) on the bath salt " pump it" the results were not suprising three "different formulas were sampled" one with a white cap one with a clear cap and one with some of the printing and warinings missing:

    * white cap had the following: Pentedrone, synephrine( a OTC nasal decongestant/ cardiac stimulant/ vasoconstrictor), caffiene,benzocaine(local anesthetic), and a b-vitamin mix predominanetly niacin with trace amounts of DMAA or dimethylamylamine/geranamine/methylhexanamine( a norepinephrine releaser).

    *Clear cap had- DMAA(norepinephrine releaser), lidocaine(local anesthetic),caffiene,synephrine,b-complex as above.

    * the missing warning clear cap- SMALL amount of DMAA,caffiene,syephrine,lidocaine- alot more niacin and instead of pink crystals it was a orangish powdery crystalline consistancy-often refered to as the bunk kind

    So as you can see the same product over the period of 3 weeks at different stores had actives in various amounts or completly lacked any RC (pentedrone), futher more Dmaa can be bought by the ounce pure at bulk nutrition outlets @ about 20$ a ounce(28grams), caffiene can be bought by the ounce at 8$-4$ and lidocaine and benzocaine are in oragel.
    Since the crack down on meth production in the US all pseudoephedrine has been replaced with phenyephrine, or synephrine( and all these do constric blood vessels and agonize beta receptors on the heart increasing rate and force.

    All of this combined is a potent stimulant that is a re-uptake inhibitor of DA/NA(pentedrone) that obviously speed up the heart constricts blood vessels and basically stimulates the body, then throw a vasoconstrictor(synephrine) to further cause the heart to work harder and further narrow vessels, then some caffiene for more adrenaline release with the same side effects as the 2 previous compounds, and something to numb the intense burn of all that shit(lido/benzocaine) and a standard cutting agent inositol(niacin)----- wich is a stroke or heart attack waiting to happen!!!!!!!!! oh and throw a vasoconstrictor and release or norepiephrine on top of it all (DMAA)


    this was the worst combination i have ever seen, in the beginning there were bath salts with 80%MDPV all the way to 98% pure mephedrone or a 1000mg bath salt with 76%methylone15% mephedrone and other inactives.any way here are the common chems used currently in many bath salys alone or in combo

    pentedrone,a-pvp,mdppp,4-fa,a-ppp,buphedrone,4-mec,desoxypiperdrol,piperdrol,caffiene,DMAA,flephe drone,4-mbc---- and many more but mainly pyrovalerone analouges and stimulant beta ketones(cathinones) and rarely piperidines

    Keep in mind that almost all pyroverone analouges are going to be dopamine specific re-uptake inhibitors and the stim cathinons are either going to have similar properties but some are releasing agents as well, and a hallmark of dopaminergic drugs is srimulation of the heart and vasoconstriction and sense most of these compouns are not very if at all serotogentic ther is more abuse potential(craving)- the nicer cathinones (4-mec,buphedrone,4-fmc,4-mab) are rare to find in cheap mass produced salts but do find there way into formulas.

    There is one thing i would like to make clear and this has puzzled me from the start-- why would anybody pay up to 40$ for 500mg or powder containing 20mg MDPV when you can get 2-3 grams of 98% or greater MDPV powder from a vendor 3,ooo mg is a insane amount of PV, the same goes for all chemicals found in bath salts- why the fuck would you pay 25$ for 100-200mg of DMAA with 300mg caffiene and lidocaine, its isnanely stupid.............. but before you get critical there are very pure single substance bath salts they are very rare but they are around.



    Now back for a moment to MDPV this is hypothetical but true: Ok you have 500mg of nearly pure MDPV in front of you and your about to goto work so you vape/snort/ingest 10-15mg boom you high, about 2 hrs later or less your mesolymbic dopamine reward center says hey man hey, let take some more im likin this... so into the bathroom you go and eyeball 20mg up the nose, and your set for a while........... well its friday and the girls or guys want to go out you being human and on PV all day needs a eye opener so another 10-20mg up the nose folllowed by copious drinking some benzos and a buddy wants to try some so hey heres 10mg fot you and fuck it 10mg for me, well you obviously dont sleep that night but have all kinds of shopping and you have to meet with the EX and have dinnner plans so @ 5:34 A.M. you welcome the day with 15mg--stop!!! in less than 48hrs you have had around 70mg PV, OOOOO .. but wait the Half Life of MDPV is 35-48hrs( the amount of time it takes for your body to eliminate 50% of the substance from the body)... WICH MOST PEOPLE DONT CARE TO KNOW OR DONT KNOW, OR DONT UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS CAN DO.

    .........So you start the day and notice Damn i barely put a dent in the bag, and this shits good i feel fine,.. i will bring a little for the day and repeat the consumtion like yesterday althouth slightly higher amounts due to tolerance, and by the end of the dinner you feeling gross.... hands are shaky and cold,headache,dehydration and lack of proper nutrition has begun to take its toll. so you go home pop 4mg xanax with 3 beers and get maybe 2 hrs of shitty sleep, well the next morning you feel tired depressed and strung out, time for a 30mg booster, and BOOOM- it hits dopamine toxiicity/amphetamine psychosis whatever you want to call it.


    This is the reaction you hear about ,i had personally expirienced it and the hallucinations are so so real you CANNOT DISTINGUISH THEM FROM REALITY AT ALL, this is nothing like acid ,2-ce,2cb-fly,shrooms and pcp and the other arylcyclohexylamines, do not even come close to the alien, paranoid world your in. There is no hallucination because what you are seeing feeling hearing and smellin is real, for instance all the cars had faceless police officers in full uniform, kids playing soccer in the street one scoring a goal( i could hear them shit talk and laugh- i asked my mother- what parents let their children play soccer in the street at 3 A.M., as i watched my truck be consumed by a army of black and red ants, and i got lost in a 4X5 square foot bathroom, after 1,400mg of seroquel/5mg klonopin there was only a reduction in agitation.---more tommarow

    Its just crazy i mean yes there are alot of people who love bath salts and that kind of thing, but I personally watched a documentary about a guy who wanted to capitalize on the curent craze, you see alot of bath salt buyers NOT ALL go to there local head shop and see the new salt and here its the shit and dont care they just call it synth cocaine like the media, and hell if it get you high then why question it, but back to the DOC i watched the guy bought 500 or so little containers, bought a lable maker and used any of the folowing words in any order:bliss,happy,snow,go-fast,nirvana,heavenly,tranquility,euphoria,white, yayo, lightining, any positive mood- look in a dictionary shit call it : positive mind frame/ productive attitude powder,
    then HE BOUGHT 8-10 GRAMS OF 98-99% PURE- CATHINONE X/pyrovalerone analouge-(pentedrone,a-pvp,a-ppp,3,4-DMC, ect ect) from a buk RC vendor for 140$ ...... and made the lables put them on the containers and put the main STIM along with the usual -caffiene, diet pill ingredients, and a numbing agent- classic bath salt right........

    ...... the guy making the bath salts was interviewed and several not suprising Qs were asked like : do you care who these are being marketed to, and you do know people are going to snort shoot or ingest these in some manner,
    The guy did not give a shit about who took them or how thew were going to be taken
    NOTE: THERE HAVE BEEN SEVERAL SHOWS ON TV SIMILAR TO THIS

    the guy proceeds to say he randomly mixes the actives an inactives in random quantities an does not if you get a potent bunk one, hes looking at a total investment including:shipping,advertising,source aquisition, manufactuer(mixing powders), distribution,
    of less or equal to 250-350$( so he says) and charges anywhere from 20-30$ a container of salts- some place sell these for 45$ a container!! with 25mg or less of active in each container depending on potency of primary active-BOOSTING IT WITH the FAVS like methylhexanamine(DMAA,geranamine),synephrine,caffi ene,theobromine, non-active beta-phenylethylamine, yohimbine,octopamine ect other primary synergistic actives EX: MD-PPP/pentylone

    it shows his process- no sanitary precautions were used a spoon or flat knife was used to mix the ingredients then the colorful awesome lable is put on and he shipps them, that 275$ or so investment nets him thousands , and he doest this cycle every week,

    the way these are made is simple, i could order 4 grams of mdpv 15 grams of caffiene 20 grams of DMAA some procaine and jars with a lable maker and do this, why dont i?

    well if you were the chemist student who synthed mppp a pethidine analouge(demerol) and had MPTP as a neurotoxic by product that would suck, he maid this to use and sell, and the mppp is a opioid but the MPTP is a dopamine neurotoxin and when administered to the human body, crosses the BBB (blood brain barier) and rapidly destroys dopammine receptors, leadind to parkinsons , alot of times from the forst doese.... the guy later was treated with LEVODOPA - a source of dopamine- and symptoms improved slightly, then he died months later from a cocaine OD, in the meantime this recipe was sols/ spread over to other chemist and lots of heroin users or opioid users became afflicted with this parkinsons like brain trauma, some died many never recovered, forever they will be lost due to one shot of 'synthetic heroin'-bullshit name,

    MOVING ON:

    you could find bath salts that are pure and run basic reagent tests to determine what compounds are in them, and there are some that are a stim with 1 inert filler,
    This would be nice.... if you only had access to them and not a vendor and wanted to snort a purer product,
    finding out the chemical and say the filler, you could determine if 1 was water soluable and one wasnt and dissolve the mix in water and filter witha micron filter( on a syringe), thats too good though,,,.
    More than likely you will have to use various solvents polar and non-polar at different temps to pull actives out(dichloromethane,ether,tetrahydrofuran,acetone, naptha, ethyl alcohol, isopropyl alcohol ect.
    then evap and redo to make shure, then perform another series of tests to see what is left in the powder and if your solvents left anf heavy metals behind.

    LOOONG story short., i have tried some of these.. and at the beginning i thought its a great tool, for work, school, partying, . but how many batches and products are you going to run before your body says no.
    i mean spend 3 months blasting MDPV up your nose, then another 2-4 with pentedrone with the other crap you use: ethanol,pot,pharms, dietary supps,

    pt2. so its been a while and after the massive ban on cathinones and basically all pyrovalerones/analouges of there could be some reallly decent ''party pills'' or powders as the compunds out now are more condusive to qulity effects with consideration to side effects.

    although it would take a decent amount of pure lidocaine to tolerate 2-FMA and 4-FA and even the surviving a-pvp/a-pvt could provide a decent bath salt like product, but better yet the 4-FA and 2-FA/ 2-FMA would make far better party pills, not to mention 6-apb wich was actually out in headshops for a while in pressed pill form, although now you wont find them for the fear of being prosecuted, although you might find a ballsy shop.

    the party pill thing has actually seemed to survive alot better as there was and is less fear and media over these + different marketing, keep in mind the originals has 2-FMA,4-MMC and ethylcathinone as ingredients in isreal but alot has evolved since that time..

    it went from single or double entity actives to 3-6 entity products with weird non-active fillers and other weird shit, so beware and get a test kit.
    Last edited by t9358; 01-21-2013 at 03:22 AM.
    "you can always ingest more of a chemical to reach desired effect, but never take back what you have already ingested"

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to t9358 For This Useful Post:

    growl (07-06-2012)

  3. #2
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    I really hate the term and the actually stuff known as "bath salts." I wish people would fucking do their research and get some real chemical that you know what you are getting and what the effects are. I kinda wish the term bath salt wouldn't be used anymore especially on this site. I want REAL legit experience with pure chemicals. Instead I hear reviews of these 'amped' powders and such, I really don't see how snorting that stuff can be that fun. OR maybe I am kinda done with those types of stimulants...I am not sure haha.
    rawr

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    remember though that 5-meo-dalt was in the product lucy n nate, and phenazepam was found in the xanax like "lotus extract bars" and DXM in some of the red dawn pills, and MXE in the matrix powder/caps. and there was a nbome in a party pill for a brief few weeks, but yeah i hate the branded products,

    but GROWL with meth being so popular in the states why wouldnt bath salts be so fukin popular, but

    ANYBODY WHO is one of those: "man did you try the last batch of nuclear euphorobliss power super pluse extreame energy powder, it was so good i was railing like 3 inch lines and went through like 4 containers in 3 days, but now i have to do the whole container just to get a buzz"
    in the meantime they snorted like 5 different chems some are over the counter, check ecstacy data.org some of those salts are plain caffiene then the same product is desoxy pipradrol caffiene pentylone and lidocaine, and oooooooooooops OD.
    "you can always ingest more of a chemical to reach desired effect, but never take back what you have already ingested"

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    pretty biased article...more like a rant but i personally would never buy a salt that had sharpie writing on it. haha. matter of fact most of the good brands were so plentiful that yeah... not saying that shit don't happen but i think we're throwing worse case scenario here.

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    this was for harm reduction/education...... not my opinions
    "you can always ingest more of a chemical to reach desired effect, but never take back what you have already ingested"

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    dude branded products are dog shit most of the time squirl ,,,,,,,,,,,,, GET RC;s or are you another one of those dead heads that will take snort shoot anything. peace beaoch have funn with your bath salts
    "you can always ingest more of a chemical to reach desired effect, but never take back what you have already ingested"

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    +growl is fine person i will defend till the end
    "you can always ingest more of a chemical to reach desired effect, but never take back what you have already ingested"

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    Default vendors?

    Does anyone out there kknow of any good vendors I can use to get some of the better ones, or any that ship to the states? Even though sourcing is not allowed could you tell me anyway, i'm a really nice person and i promise not to tell anyone else and I won't let any authority types read the reply. Thanks in advance, and I'm looking for the closest thing to meth but without any toxicity or comedown, something that won't make me see things after 4 days cause I drive semis for a living.

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    I saw a lady do some of the first bath salts the other day on a cheech & chong movie
    The feds came & tested the ajax & it turned Blue which indicated some high grade stuff
    1978!

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    Quote Originally Posted by squirrelmaster View Post
    pretty biased article...more like a rant but i personally would never buy a salt that had sharpie writing on it. haha. matter of fact most of the good brands were so plentiful that yeah... not saying that shit don't happen but i think we're throwing worse case scenario here.
    OMg dude the synth mdma I took made me sicker than any real shit ever did.

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