Herbal and chemical treats for stimulant-induced insomnia

[FriendlyToker]

I'm looking for a remedy for stimulant-induced insomnia, particularly LU Doves (bk-MBDB as far as I know), but other ketones/piperazines and stimulants as well. I never slept after an evening on LU Doves, not even a blink of sleep. I always had to use 450mg of Codeine with alot of smoking blend or cannabis next day to feel any closer to normal. Day after it I still could feel groggy and lacking food and sleep (as I couldn't eat sometimes even two days after LU Doves ingestion).
I'm interested in herbal and chemical remedies. I presume Passiflora Incarnata would not be a good choice, even though it's sedative, because it also works as a MAOi. Valerian could come in handy, though. I also think GBL could be very, very helpful, as it can induce severe dizzyness and sleep. It's powerful, but I have no idea about neither dosage nor safety of them.
Any other plants that I could use for treating this? Any advices, experiences?

[xxdd]

GBL's probably not the safest thing to use to sleep.

I use melatonin to get to sleep, usually 3mg if I've taken some kind of stimulant, sometimes a bit more.

[enduin]

I got quite some experience with herbs for sleep, as I tried so hard to find something for my insomnia (not stimulant-related :() and nothing worked for me, but I'm kind of hardhead and many times benzos doesn't work too...
Anyway, here's a list:

California poppy, as a tea, I tried many big spoons, it's a safe herb. Worked at the beginning, but seems like I also develop a super fast tolerance.

Passiflora incarnata, use an extract. It's a super weak MAOI, so it's most likely not gonna cause any problems. Worked quite good, but same as poppy.

Kava, don't overdo (in particular with extracts) as it can cause nausea at high doses, and don't drink alcohol with it. Didn't work very good but it can be me.

Corydalis ambigua, or pure THP isolate, it's supposed to be quite potent, but be careful as it can damage the liver. I tried a low dosage with no much of results and didn't want to try harder.

Lady's slipper (cypripedium pubescens), quite good, lasted longer than the others before my fuckingsuperquicktolerance took over. It's a safe plant, no side effects.

Valeriana never really worked for me. Melatonin had zero effects on me.

These are the ones that come to mind, and that I tried, will update ifI remember others.

[FriendlyToker]

I used melatonin, never really worked for me.
I'm rather looking for OTC meds, and some more information for using GBL for stimulant-induced insomnia, besides "it is bad". Why is it? What makes it dangerous?
Thank you for your post, enduin. I am not really keen on trying even the very weak imao while using stimulants and empathogens. I can't find these herbs anywhere, besides the passiflora. Kava is illegal, so there's no way to obtain it.

[GOA]

Melatonin helps regulate your sleep cycle aspect for circadian rhythms... not really much of a sleep aid IMO. Try using something like diphenhydramine to get to sleep. 100-150mg would definitely be sufficient. More will induce antichlorinergic hallucinations, if that's your thing. :rolleyes:

[Live4evr]

Why not use alcohol to induce drowsiness

I've always done alcohol or Nyquil after Doves sessions....I particularly find Nyquil to be damn good in knocking me out.

[enduin]

I used melatonin, never really worked for me.
I'm rather looking for OTC meds, and some more information for using GBL for stimulant-induced insomnia, besides "it is bad". Why is it? What makes it dangerous?
Thank you for your post, enduin. I am not really keen on trying even the very weak imao while using stimulants and empathogens. I can't find these herbs anywhere, besides the passiflora. Kava is illegal, so there's no way to obtain it.

I can give you a link where to buy them, for kava being illegal I think no one gives a shit...

Alcohol is worse than gbl IMHO, as both stress the liver for metabolization (with alcohol the amount is much greater), but while gbl metabolite is ghb which is harmless, alcohol's metabolites (like acetic acid) are pretty toxic. This as far as I know.

[GOA]

Stimulants over-power alcohol. Don't waste your time and money. Kava's not a great sedative either. Nyquil, maybe, as it has DXM and an antihistamine similar to diphenhydramine--doxylamine succinate. Kinda expensive to use Nyquil, so buy the fuckin diphenhydramine. You can get a budget brand bottle of 50-100 pills for pretty cheap.

[piracetam101]

A legal benzo is really what your askin for.

Bendryal (Diphenhydramine) maybe, but even then if you don't pass out and your still awake you'll feel worse than before.

A benzo script is pretty easy to obtain and they're readily available online for cheap from intl' pharmacys with no script required.

[Spaced out]

Why don't you try smoking'?
Weed or blends :)

[FriendlyToker]

Diphenhydramine didn't really help, tried. Made me feel restless even worse, totally wanting to sleep but without success. Smoking blends or green never makes me sleep, when I smoke before going to bed I always find myself very active.
What about 5:1 valerian ethanol extract? I'm still looking for these OTC herb medications.
Nyquil is not the best idea, dxm could cause serotonin syndrome or potentiate some unwanted side-effects.
Benzodiazepines aren't my piece of cake, tried few, always ended up with a huge memory loss and doing crazy things rather than sleeping.
I used Melatonin in doses 5 to 30mg, it really was sometimes even more difficult to sleep on it.
I'm still thinking of GBL, as it can cause quick drowsiness and knock a person out fairly quickly. Even that three hours of coma-like sleep (2-3ml could be alright for inducing that kind of sleep) would be a bliss.

[enduin]

Im gonna PM you the link if you want, but I think the herbs out there are not strong enough to knock you out if you are on stims... made exception for the pure THP, but I wouldn't feel like to suggest you.
With benzos maybe you just have to find the right molecule, like for example the ones with super short half-life, they should minimize the memory loss and at good amount knock you out.

Otherwise have you thought about kratom? 5g SGI + 1g DEI gave me strong sedation and I passed out for an hour while lucid dreaming and stuff. I have not considered using it for everyday insomnia because it would be pretty damn expensive and quite tolerance/addiction risky, but you could give it a try!

[enduin]

Oh and another thing is myrrh isolates, I heard very good things on it, opiate-like sedation!

[valseedian]

I use diphenhydramine daily to sleep, usually in unison with valerian and melatonin. I'm not exactly sure what does it, but the combo seems to do the trick, even if it does take a few hours..

I also take 5-htp in the morning 100mg, and smoke weed+ synthetics. 6mg of cp-47 is enough to put me away at night

(does reallllllly activate my hppd, so it's like a really cheap trip)

[GOA]

I use diphenhydramine daily to sleep, usually in unison with valerian and melatonin. I'm not exactly sure what does it, but the combo seems to do the trick, even if it does take a few hours..

I also take 5-htp in the morning 100mg, and smoke weed+ synthetics. 6mg of cp-47 is enough to put me away at night

(does reallllllly activate my hppd, so it's like a really cheap trip)

Well, I'm glad it works for somebody else. :o

[enduin]

Ok, last but not the least: mulungu 95% alkaloids extract, I've heard very good things on it, with reported benzo-like effects. I think this could be the best among the ones I posted. Never tried but will do it as soon as I'll place the next kratom order (the vendor got it as well)!

[FriendlyToker]

Looks like I won't need this remedy anymore. Take a look at the Jax Bath Salts topic and read my report, you'll see why. ;)

[enduin]

Those Jax seems to be quite a treat! Even if quite overpriced...
Good for you that you are not gonna need downers!

[piracetam101]

If you have access to a selection of weed you could try going for purple buds.

There's grape ape, purple erkle, the list goes on!

Everytime I smoked these I passed out no problem. And if you don't, your high as fuck :-) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2spZ-NDfS4)

[VALIS]

Benzos (valium, xanax) are said to work well for this, as long as you know that regular use is a problem. They are good for reducing anxiety, if nothing else.

[depeche1980]

my regimen is I drink cabarnet red wine during the time I'm using stims. It takes the edge off and provides a nice buzz to go along because you don't feel the grogginess but you still get the relaxation. Then it makes me tired at the end of the night and I'm usually able to sleep for at least 4 hours, as opposed to my mind racing into the morning.

I also take a 5htp brand which is mixed with Valerian. It's verrrry soft -- no groggy feeling the next day like benzos. This 5htp valerian combo is about the best thing I've used other than benzos which I only used in extreme cases (meth laced pills or that crappy mexican coke that is cut with ephedrine).

Sometimes... actually, usually, I get chest tightening with stims. I found that doing meditation for 5 minutes, the kind where you set and stare at the wall and count up from 1 while you clear your mind works! Also I breath in deeply and then exhale for 3-4 seconds (or exhale 3x the time you inhaled). This is a Buddhist technique which induces relaxation.

[VALIS]

For sure, benzos make you groggy, but so can red wine.;)

[shizerbeard]

xanax is great for KOing you after stim use

[VALIS]

Indeed, but overuse of benzos is to be avoided at all costs. Benzos addiction is said to very nasty.

[introverted]

Indeed, but overuse of benzos is to be avoided at all costs. Benzos addiction is said to very nasty.

yeah, seizures aren't ok, mmmmk

[shizerbeard]

indeed. But if you need to sleep after a long binge theres nothing better. Vallies also do the trick for lu doves, have used with success

Unless your tanking the stims every few days then you wont need that much benzos over a period of time

I dont usually have a stash of them but occasionly i do get some in. Its key to keep them for when you need them though, and not just go "ah fuck it ill have one tonight.."

[VALIS]

They are something to be used occasionally, nothing much in themselves. There is nothing better to smooth those jagged feelings and induce sleep.